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Josep Pons, conductor of the
National Orchestra of Spain, says that your adaptation
of ‘Iberia’ “demonstrates the great
rhythmic strength of the work”. Do you agree?
Perhaps. Since flamenco is a kind of
rhythmic music and I start from that base, well of course.
But naturally, I do it respecting the nuances he wanted
in the score, but the character is flamenco. When he brings
out a tanguillo, I bring out a tanguillo; when he brings
out a soleá, I bring out a soleá; when he
brings out a verdial, I bring it out from the flamenco
base I start out from.
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Cañizares (Photo
Daniel Muñoz) |
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The suite has different parts
alluding to Seville, Triana, Málaga... Does Albéniz
capture the essence of each flamenco territory?
I think so. For example, in Málaga
you find a very slow, nearly disguised verdial, but it’s
there. I think Albéniz was a flamenco lover. In
fact, he was adviser to Falla and Granados in the way
of composing when they were all in Paris. There’s
an anecdote. It is said that there, Albéniz told
Falla to stop composing like a German and to start listening
to more cante flamenco and Spanish folklore, which is
where it was at. It was the era of nationalists, Debussy
in France... and of course in Spain, Albéniz, Falla,
Granados and Felipe Pedrell, who was the father of that
entire movement. He did the ‘Cancionero musical
popular español’ and went around gathering
melodies from out and about, from shepherds. And some
started off from his work and his teachings.
What do you take from Albéniz
for your music?
Many things, many passages, many ambiences,
really good music... which is what Albéniz used
to do. And you always learn from music, because to me,
more than studying from a book, which seems really interesting
to me, it’s much more interesting to go to the original
source. It’s not that the books on music theory
are of no use; of course they’re valid. But when
you get into composing, music is something more than a
mathematical formula. And you realize that when you get
into projects of this magnitude, when you start to discover
how many wonderful things there are, which sound with
incredible harmony. ‘Iberia’ is a job which
has given me many nuances when playing. I think that in
a certain way, I’ve changed, I’m evolving...
I think for the better.
Do you miss the discipline and
order of classical music in flamenco?
I think flamenco has suffered from the
prestige of ignorance. If you can’t read, you’re
more flamenco. If you don’t know music, you’re
more flamenco. I think those are now obsolete opinions
which don’t make sense nowadays. Really, knowledge
has its place and is useful to you for your job. It’s
useful for you to compose if not better, at least with
more awareness. And it’s useful for you to be able
to treat the music according to your profession, which
is guitar, which is flamenco and which is music. The prestige
of ignorance has done a lot of damage to flamenco. Fortunately,
there are now people with their eyes open wider, there
are conservatories and schools dedicated to teaching flamenco.
I think it’s positive for young
people to be able to enjoy music as wonderful as flamenco
is, which isn’t a closed ghetto or anything like
that. In fact, if I hadn’t known how to read music
and I hadn’t studied harmony and counterpoint back
in my time, I wouldn’t have been able to get into
a mess like this one. Impossible; I wouldn’t be
able to analyze it.
Cañizares (Foto Daniel
Muñoz)
Also for a guitarist’s
day to day life?
Of course. And to write falsetas. And
to be able to have communication with other musicians
and other types of music. I find encounters really interesting
with other kinds of music which are being made. But I
think it’s necessary to have at least basic knowledge
of the music for you to be able to communicate. How do
you agree with an orchestra when they tell you it’s
in D major? And where do I put the nut? You’re more
limited, though it’s true that flamenco is very
intuitive, it has a lot of ductility, it plays a lot with
the rhythm. It can be adapted, since rhythm is something
common to all types of music. The flamenco artist is clever
and he goes in there and comes out fine, but that’s
not his thing. I think his thing is to be a professional
and that means knowing your profession exactly, not simply
being a guitarist, but a guitarist who has his trade and
can analyze and can investigate because he has the tools.
That’s not going to make you a better guitarist,
but it is going to give you a series of resources to be
able to compose.
I’m now studying piano because
I find it really interesting to compose on the piano.
I think it’s going to complement me. I’m not
going to be a concert performer or anything like that,
nor do I have aspirations, but it is going to help me
take my stuff to guitar. Why not? Everything enhances.
I also continue to compose on the guitar, of course; it’s
much more comfortable. The other way, the effort is tremendous
because on the piano I’m just starting to learn
chords, scales. The comfortable thing is to grab the guitar,
but I’m making an effort because I think it’s
beneficial and moreover, I feel like it, which is no small
thing.
Does composing on the piano give
you another perspective for guitar?
Of course. It’s useful to you for
everything; you enjoy it much more. When you listen to
a pianist you don’t just listen to the right hand
which is doing the melody or the left hand which is doing
the accompaniment, but rather you’re listening to
both hands. Your ear is expanding, you’re developing
your senses. With music, your ear is trained. Your ear
has certain formulas which you already know intuitively
through all the music you’ve heard in your life;
in our case, western and flamenco. You have something
intuitive which is working harmoniously and melodically,
like a language.
Are you already composing for
an upcoming flamenco album?
Oh yeah. I really got going with this
album; I’m happy and I’m composing every day.
I’m going to be present more often. The record,
experiences in life... have led me to the conclusion that
the more music I make, the better. I’m “separating”
from this album, so to speak. I’m going to play
it live and it can’t be done completely, but mentally
I’m already on another wavelength. This one hasn’t
come out yet and I already have the idea for the next
one. Little by little, I’ll stick in the melodies
and the contrasts for the following record.
By the way, do you have a favorite
piece from ‘Iberia’?
I like them all because each one has
its thing, each one gets you hooked. When you follow the
melody and you listen to counterpoints around it, you
marvel at how that man composed. I’ve scrutinized
it and when you start to remove layers because you have
to simplify and you start to see the bare structure, you
discover how he thought out, developed and placed the
notes for it to sound like what he wanted to express.
It was really interesting research work. With a project
like this, you advance professionally. Musically, it helps
you to see other things. When you do things, you absorb
a lot more than when you listen to them. It’s not
the same to listen to Spanish classical music as to sit
down and research it. You start to see things that stay
with you because you include them in your experience.
And night falls next to the Teatro
Real. The streetlights are turned on, it drizzles. And
as a final message of humility, Cañizares makes
it quite clear that “it isn’t a pretentious
album”. He confirms jokingly that “now I blow
off pretension and nonsense. This album isn’t at
all about big scales, but rather essences”. And
he adds, drawing on his own experience, that “the
substance is what’s left when you get past the running
stage. It’s happened to all of us, going wildly
at first until you settle down”. So talking about
races and beginning, he has to be asked for a ‘photo’
of the new generation of guitarists: “They’re
brilliant. They have to go on there, with each of them
contributing their bit to flamenco. This is something
we’re doing between all of us”. But he has
a piece of advice: “I would ask many of them, for
I have talked to some of them, to study tradition, since
they don’t know Ramón
Montoya, or even who Niño Ricardo was. And
that would settle it. I’d first research where we
come from to later do other things, because if not we
get lost in so much traffic”.
Following the reprimand, he goes
back to encouraging words: “The kids are playing
great, it’s a time boiling over with ideas, people
get excited when a record comes out. It reminds me of
what I used to feel when I was fourteen or fifteen, when
the latest album came out by Paco de Lucía, Camarón
or Manolo Sanlúcar, and I used to go to the store
to see if it had come in... from Madrid! Sometimes I had
to wait until the following week and I couldn’t
sleep thinking about buying the record. I think that atmosphere
in flamenco is going to do it a lot of good; it really
deserves it now. Let’s see if we manage to reach
the same level as jazz, for there to be flamenco festivals
all over the world; it’d be wonderful. Let’s
see if we get a little bit organized”. And talking
about that matter of internationalization, Cañizares
goes in search of his other half, his guitar, which is
in the Conde Hermanos ‘clinic’ getting a tune-up,
getting ready for the task of turning ‘Iberia’
flamenco.
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