Javier Barón, flamenco bailaor. Interview

“Flamenco’s evolution has to be
dealt with really tactfully”

Silvia Calado. Seville, October 2006

Javier Barón starts up the creation machine once again. The Sevillian bailaor brings out two new shows. Up close and personal, he’s just premiered ‘Dos voces para un baile’ in Seville. And it will be the Jerez Festival which hosts the presentation of ‘Meridiana’, a large-scale show directed by Pedro G. Romero. He’s fully aware of the complications involved in starting up new projects, but “I don’t want to have to do without making the ideas going around in my head materialize”. And to do so, he always tries to surround himself with a good crew of professionals, since he’s among those who think that “nobody can know everything; you always have to be ready to learn”.

What is ‘Dos voces para un baile’?

‘Dos voces para un baile’, which I premiere on November 29th, is a small-scale show with a little group, a little thing I’d been after for some time now. Though to organize something, whether it’s small or bigger, your head swims just the same. I’m lucky to be able to premiere it. I’d had notes on it for a long time; I wanted to join two voices which have been present in my career, both in Madrid and Seville. And they’ve been and continue to be two very important cantaores to me. They’re Guadiana and Juan José Amador. And they really liked the idea. There’s no pretext, no story to tell; just singing, dancing and playing the guitar. The same old thing, that of my early days. In the past there wasn’t any percussion or anything like that; clappers at the most. And I felt like getting back to that simplicity.

What would you say about each of those cantaores?

They’ve been really significant people to me; they’ve always been there. I really like their voices, their way of saying it, performing it, the rhythm they have... A good cantaor for baile is someone who gets a foothold for you, contributes to you and is there with you. It isn’t just singing; for that we have the ‘up front’ cantaores. And besides being good soloists, their forte is for baile. They’ve been in quite a few companies with a great many artists. They haven’t been doing this for a short while. They’re two cantaores who are fundamental to me; they’ve been so and are so in my career as an artist.

What memories do you have of that period in Madrid?

I was there with every effort by my parents and my uncle, who took me to his house in Madrid. I made my life there at the age of 11; my uncle was my second father. I had to quit my studies; it was a mess. But afterwards they got me a private teacher and I studied with a whole lot of flamenco people: Toni el Pelao, Faíco, Rafael de Córdoba... countless people. After learning all that, I managed to put together my first little group. And at the age of fifteen or so was when Guadiana joined us. I broke off a little; I spent four years in the Spanish National Ballet (BNE), where you train in more disciplines. I’m really grateful to so many instructors... I’ve been tremendously lucky. I remember it all a lot now. When you want to create something new, it’s hard to believe, but you always go back. It’s a satisfaction to remember details such-and-such a maestro taught you. And then I went back to my group to dance flamenco. And we recorded a lovely program on Televisión Española with Guadiana, Ramón Jiménez, Paquito Cruz, Toni Maya, Ramón Porrina, and Bernardo and Juan Parrilla, who for the first time did something more innovative with the violin and flute. Guadiana still reminds me about it and tells me what class it had. I was still being called Francisco Javier... My uncle, seeking a more ‘commercial’ name, took away Francisco, which sounded like a saint to him, and added Barón, as American friends of his used to do who, like him, tried to become novilleros (apprentice matadors).

Javier Barón (Photo: Daniel Muñoz)

What guitarists are in this show?

On guitar I have Alfredo Lagos, who’s also accompanied me a lot, and Javier Patino, who’s accompanied me for a long time. They’re guitarists who have always contributed a lot to me musically. I base myself a lot on the music when creating and dancing. And it’s essential to have two guitarists like them who, though they’ve done all sorts of stuff, have stood out accompanying for dancing. Now I’ve replaced the percussion with two clappers, which I’d never had. I like to change in each show, but quite a bit... nearly ninety percent.

Does each show you premiere display that need to renew?

Yeah. I need to seek new elements, change the group, look for musical details like now doing without percussion and sticking in some clapping, also the ways and cantes that are done for you... I’m going to have Faustino Núñez as musical director. He’s been in my latest shows and I really like him; he’s a great professional, he’s understood me very well and he’s made a lot of things easier for me in the musical area. He’s helped me to give it unity. I wanted to stick a little to jondura, not to go to the usual. That’s why I like for one to plunge into the cante the cantaor’s doing. I don’t want to do bailes for the sake of bailes or cantes for the sake of cantes. I want it to flow really well, to be dynamic, not to do nine-minute bailes and then a cante for me to change. I want to plunge into them and for them to plunge into me. For there to be freedom to step on each other’s feet, for there to be an exchange. Nor is it easy to carry out the notes you have in your head. When it premieres there’ll still be things to polish, but there’s always a chance to study it further. It can’t be done to perfection the first day. I do want to use the vocals well: for one to be doing a tone, for the other to do a cante... That mix would be nice. I want to squeeze them. And that’s hard enough. Besides dancing, you have to know how to count (ha ha ha).

Is there a return to more up-close flamenco?

As far as I can tell, nowadays there’s a lot of interest among young people to seek out the old-time stuff. And young people are the ones who can take us to the future. You see it in some details in certain shows: in well-chosen lyrics, even if they’re folk ones; in the musical... And they’re really simple things, but they’re liked and thanked for. I’m not saying for us not to evolve and mix music, but people are moving really quickly. The evolution has to be dealt with tactfully. You can’t go helter-skelter, to see what happens, to see how the audience reacts.

That’s why I’m a person who doesn’t want to monopolize everything; rather, I’ve tried to surround myself with a crew of professionals ever since I did ‘Baile de hierro, baile de bronce’, where I had a stage director for the first time. Anyone who says he knows everything... is lying. You need to put together a team. When I did ‘Dime’ it seemed really simple, but then it’s complicated. You can have an idea, but also someone to develop it for you. And you go along adding, removing, helping. In the end you bring really interesting people together and it enriches you. I think you have to work humbly. It’s really hard for me to give guidelines to my colleagues, the cantaores, the guitarists... even the clappers, who are also important, since I see them as an instrument. I need someone to get across to them what I want, what I need, since he’s surely going to communicate it better than me. This way of working has always gone really well for me; things have flowed and improved. At the beginning it all seems chaotic, but as you create and fatten up the idea, each of us starts to realize where we are.

And large-scale? What are you getting ready?

At the Jerez Festival in late February, I’ll premiere ‘Meridiana’. I’ll take a vacation from these two projects in July or August, because this is going to be crazy. We’re in the planning stage. A lot of people are being counted on ‘a priori’, but agendas have to be squared off. And I’m really whimsical about the artists I want to work with; they can’t change the group on me just like that. Pedro G. Romero is directing it for me; we’ve been working on it for a few days now. And in the musical part there’s José Manuel Gamboa, who I’m driving a little bit dizzy. And they’re dizzying me. I’ve given it the title ‘Meridiana’. It comes from a sundial we saw next to the Cathedral in Seville, since I’m basing myself on time. It doesn’t have a script, or a plot; I focus on the rhythm. There might be more people dancing, but it’s not a sure thing yet.

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