ENRIQUE MORENTE, FLAMENCO CANTAOR. INTERVIEW
“I have to put it on the
line
in every stage”
Silvia Calado. Madrid, November 2009
Translation: Joseph Kopec
Aurora was the one who had the
idea. “Don’t go and make another one of those
modern records”, his wife told him. And he grabbed
a box from the top of his closet holding live recordings
of over a decade of Enrique
Morente’s cante. Stemming from the best pickings
from that box is ‘Morente Flamenco’, the first
live album by the Granada-born cantaor. And him being one
of those few unpredictable artists in this genre, it’s
a guarantee that “those versions there are on the
album are unique”. That synthetic anthology includes
tangos, soleares, granaínas, fandangos, references
to maestros such as Matrona and Sernita, the everlasting
guitars of the Habichuelas, Riqueni’s special musicality,
Cerreduela’s spirit… But first and foremost,
there’s Morente-style risk. And hence, of course,
it comes complete with a studio creation… the lullaby
which the children sing to their mothers.
The conversation begins with the recorder
I’m carrying, a tiny mp3 which Enrique finds wonderful;
“it looks like a lighter”. I tell him that it’s
really convenient to put the audio files on the computer
and forget about cassette tapes, which used to take up space
and get chewed up... “Yeah, yeah, but I trusted tapes
more; you rewound, checked it was there and that’s
it”. And that leads us straight into the matter at
hand, the first live album by the Granada-born cantaor,
‘Morente
Flamenco’. The disc’s booklet indicates
in the credits of each cante, besides when and where it
was recorded, the recording medium: four tracks, revox,
cassette…
How did you decide that those recordings
would become an album?
They were in a box at the top of a closet
and when I told my wife, Aurora, that I had to make a record
for Universal, she told me not to go and make another modern
album like the ones I make, but rather to make a good record
once and for all, since times were tough, hee hee hee. And
she reminded me that I had some tapes there, to look and
see… Things appeared from diverse moments, but I haven’t
put them all on; just some of them. That’s how the
album was made.
What were the selection criteria?
It’s selected along the lines of
traditional flamenco cante, like a little anthology. And
it has cantes which hadn’t been recorded for some
time now.
Although you’re now a maestro
for young people, you still remember yours, with two very
clear references: Pepe de la Matrona and Sernita de Jerez.
This album is a consequence of all the
cante I’ve listened to by the old-timers. Nowadays
we have the entire flamenco cante archives recorded and
digitalized; all the slate and vinyl records have been put
on CD and are available to any youth who wants to learn
the cantes. However, since we didn’t even have a record
player back then, I learned all these cantes in person,
from they themselves and working live, at night at the parties…
You had really close experience
with Pepe de la Matrona…
Oh yes, really friendly, a great friendship
and great appreciation. I was always ready to learn.
The guitarists who accompany you
are very different. Does each one lead you to sing differently?
Oh, of course. I sing with Juan and with
Pepe
Habichuela, who are brothers; two extraordinary guitarists.
As each person is a world apart, I sing differently with
each of them. And then there’s Rafael
Riqueni, who gets up in the morning with his hair standing
up on end and he’s a brilliant guitarist. I sing differently
with him. I have hungry wolf cantes there, hee hee hee.
What saves me is Rafael’s guitar, which is extraordinary.
You’ve always traveled the
road together with Pepe…
With Pepe there have been many years of
encounters, of work and we’re like family. And now
playing and singing, we don’t need many rehearsals.
And there’s also David Cerreduela,
with a Cañorroto trademark…
It’s a different sound, like the
sound of Madrid’s flamenco is; more universal. Davicillo
plays extraordinarily, with extraordinary spirit and energy…
and reminiscent of Paco
de Lucía.
In your live shows, you can always
see a surprise factor, a risk factor… Do you think
that feature is captured on the album?
Yes, those versions there are on the album
are unique. I’m not saying they’re good or bad,
but they’re unique.
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“We
should never look down on studio work because the best
records in flamenco history have been made at the studio”
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However, the most usual thing in
flamenco is for the cantaor to always perform the canon…
I respect that and I admire it. Moreover,
I’ve studied what the cantes are like. But I do the
cantes the way they come out; I don’t follow those
rules about doing cante the way it is or the way it’s
said to be. You have to respect those who do it that way,
but I have to put it on the line in each stage; if not,
I prefer disaster. If I sing five sets of lyrics and three
turn out bad but two are really good, it’s great…
considering what I do. Well, every way of making music deserves
respect. Mine is the one I have; I don’t have any
other and it doesn’t have any merit.
Some of those recordings were carried
out at venues as unique as El Bañuelo in Granada.
How do you sing there?
Yes, I sing with Riqueni in that Arab bath.
That day he got there really early in the morning and I
found it strange because every day we used to have to go
and get him at the hotel. I don’t know if he’d
even gone to bed. And he took out his guitar at El Bañuelo,
which is an Arab bath in Carrera del Darro. Singing isn’t
usually done there, but I asked the Board for permission
because I started to record something there about Picasso
in film footage, which I haven’t continued yet. I
start a lot of projects, but then they come to a standstill…
I say that I’ll finish them sometime, that I’ll
continue them sometime and I still have this one on hold.
Part of the sound was with Rafael at the Arab bath and the
film footage is begun… It’s a short film I began,
or medium-length, not short, I don’t know. The rest
are more normal festivals, performances at theaters or auditoriums.
What sensations or experiences
lie in those cantes?
There are always numerous sensations behind
a recording. You’re recording and things happen every
day. And the dog’s bark cuts in and what do you do?
Your dog’s?
Mine? Mine has a brilliant voice lately,
hee hee hee. I really hired the dog for a song and I recorded
a bulería as a joke and I’ve never brought
it out and the dog sings great there! If I bring it out,
I’ll give you a copy. When I’ve played it for
some friends of mine they’ve looked around asking
where the dog was. And I told them, no, no, it’s just
another cantaor!
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“The
studio doesn’t have the live show’s expression;
it has a different spirit, something else”
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What difference are those who listen
to the album going to find between the Enrique Morente of
the live show and that of the studio?
I’m the same, but dressed differently,
with a different hairstyle. The studio doesn’t have
the live show’s expression; it has a different spirit,
something else. We should never look down on studio work
because the best works are recorded at the studio, the best
records in flamenco history have been made at the studio.
A studio isn’t for repeating; you have to have the
work done because if you start repeating too much thinking
that it’s going to end up coming out the way you think,
it never comes out. At the studio you have to have the music
stuck there in your ears, in your senses. However, in live
performances, it’s right here, right now.
Why are hardly any live flamenco
albums released?
It’s done less because, of course,
it’s a little scary. A ton of flaws come out.
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“I
want to demythologize that idea that authentic flamenco
is in private fiestas”
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And nevertheless, it’s always
said to be a type of music of improvisation, of live performance.
No. I want to demythologize that idea that
authentic flamenco lies in “el cuarto de los cabales”.
There’s some truth in that, but the studio allows
you to create, allows you to perfect, to be creative…
In fact, on the album, you didn’t
do without bringing out a new creation: ‘Nana de oriente’.
Of course. ‘Nana de oriente’
is the only song on the album created entirely at the studio.
And there was another live song which I haven’t put
on the disc, but it is at iTunes to buy on the Internet.
It’s a song which has a lot of spirit live, you see
really clearly the difference between live cante and studio
cante. However, I took it off the album because it isn’t
a classical cante. Although it has a soleá tempo,
it’s inspired by Leonard Cohen’s ‘Aleluya’
off my album ‘Omega’. I mean, it’s not
a flamenco cante, but it’s sung with a lot of spirit.
The lullaby is special because
of its subject, because of those who sing with you…
It’s a special song because the children
sing the lullaby to the mother, not the mother to the children.
And it’s about children’s loneliness; some for
one reason and others for another. Some necessarily left
nowadays; there’s no other choice because their mothers
have to go out and work. And also because of another series
of suffering which I’m not going to mention in order
not to be demagogic with the subject. It’s a play
on mothers’ song, on the word ‘mare’ with
‘mar’, with mare nostrum (our sea),
with the waves, with the mamma italiana that is the same
in the Arab world and here in many villages of ours. Well,
a somewhat surrealistic idea. The important thing is that
the children sing with a lot of naivety and a lot of innocence…
the way that only children can sing.
You wanted to call it ‘Nana
de Guerra’, didn’t you?
Yes, it had that title but it seemed demagogic
and opportunistic to me and I didn’t name it that.
It’s called ‘Nana de Oriente’.
But it has that denunciation side
to it of ‘Guernirak’ which opens your previous
album, ‘Pablo de Málaga’.
Inevitably. Then in Granada I’m told
that I’m a filthy red and I don’t want that,
hee hee hee, because then I have to go back home
and to the neighborhood.
There we once again hear your daughter
Soleá’s voice a little bit…
Soleá’s, Estrella’s,
Estrella’s children’s, who are my grandchildren,
and other children from the Polígono neighborhood.
They’re charming; I had a great time with them. And
now I’ve started to really feel like doing stuff with
children. A long time ago I did a thing for children on
a tour around France. And the concept of the concert had
been organized by a guitarist friend of mine as a strict,
serious anthology, with the soleá of Tío Manuel
el del Zapato Cojo, the I-don’t-know-who family, the
Caganchos of Barcelona… The children fell asleep,
poor things. They were children from a lot of schools who
went to an auditorium in the morning. So I said we’d
change the repertoire, because they were going to start
throwing piece of gum at us. I started changing the repertoire
for them, with cheers, Christmas carols, really simple things
they can clap to and have fun with. By the end, I seemed
like the idol of the children of France. The last day I
sang them a martinete… and they liked it, too.
And is Soleá going to keep
on singing?
She sings well, doesn’t she? She
says she’s looking forward to it, that… Then
come on and sing, I tell her. And I’m afraid we now
have this on top of everything else. She has a small voice
but it’s well-tuned. And I don’t know what she’ll
do because she’s finished her Hispanic degree…
But I think she likes singing more. Besides, the record
company wants her to. And if she wants, I’m going
to help her and I’m always going to be with her, no
matter which way she goes.
Speaking of young cantaores, how
is it that being a maestro and a veteran, you’re still
the most revolutionary one? Don’t the new cantaores
seem to be a little inhibited?
There are young people doing things and
things really well done. For example, I like what Pitingo
does. And he’s a good cantaor who did really good
classical flamenco stuff on his first album. And let’s
not mention guitar. In baile there’s the wonderful
madman Israel
Galván and a lot of people. There are people
who are trying to move forward, the thing is that it’s
not easy. Everything has its cycles. They have to stop a
little, they have to learn and understand the cantes in
order to do what they want later on. They can’t cheat
before learning how to play. So they’re with the do
we dare or don’t we, yes, here I go… if I act
like a boring old guy, bad news, if I act like Enrique Morente,
even worse…
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“I
think that in flamenco you have to try and bring out
one’s personality and be sincere with oneself”
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I think you have to try and bring out one’s
personality, not be a mere imitator of others, be sincere
with oneself and sing what you consider appropriate and
what you’re excited about singing at each point in
time. Everything tends to become standardized, with CDs
and with recorded music some sound a lot like others. And
it’s more worrying in flamenco than in other genres.
What I do recommend, of course, is not to be afraid to make
music. For them not to be afraid to be bold, but not to
be bold either to be more interesting or to see if you’re
more successful, although all of this is so to speak, since
it’s reasonable. Of course it’s reasonable for
a young man or woman to try and be more interesting and
to want to be successful. But the leading motive and substance
of the matter should be to make art, to make music. I see
it that way, but I’m not one to tell anybody how they
have to do things. It’s a delicate subject and more
so in art.
Young people surely like listening
to your advice…
Yeah, well, it’s good to talk to
them like that. I’m a friend to everybody; to Arcángel,
Pitingo, Poveda, Duquende, Joselito de Lebrija, everyone.
There’s a really good breeding ground, they’re
really good cantaores… And if we’re not careful,
the cantaoras will kick us out of Spain!
A few days ago the documentary
‘Tiempo de Leyenda’ was broadcast on television
and when I saw Camarón wearing the red worker’s
overalls and holding the mike in his hands, I thought we
were very old today…
Camarón
was a real handful, he was.
And what will be next for Enrique
Morente?
I haven’t even finished this yet!
There are things, there are projects… about eighteen
or twenty. I don’t know which of them we’re
tackling. I might just as easily talk about one and then
do another; I don’t know. What I feel like is for
Estrella to record now; it’s important for her to
get going. I’m going to call her up right now…
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