TOMATITO, FLAMENCO GUITARIST. INTERVIEW
“There’s always
been a bit of musical racism towards flamenco”
Silvia Calado. Madrid, April 2010
Translation: Joseph Kopec
When ‘Sonanta suite’
was still just a prototype, Tomatito admitted that he felt
like a little ant surrounded by an entire symphony orchestra.
Six years later and with the album recently listened-to
at Sonoland Studios, he says he still feels like a little
ant, “but now I’m in the right frame of mind
to be one”. A high risk has been taken in this project,
since none other than the Orquesta Nacional de España
(National Orchestra of Spain) performs his music, the music
of a flamenco guitarist. And it plays por tarantas, por
soleá and por alegrías, that’s to say,
the classical musicians have tackled the challenge of flamenco’s
rhythmics. And flamenco, that of alliance.
Right before the technician pressed
the play button, the record company spokesman said that
the studio work has been complex…
It really has been hard work since we wanted
it all to sound like a tight-knit group. Having an orchestra
play music by a flamenco is complicated. And look, after
a great deal of work, we’ve achieved it.
What difficulties did the classical
musicians have?
The classical musicians’ difficulty
is rhythmical, in the styles of rhythm. But they treated
it well, hee hee hee.
And the flamenco guitarist?
Such a little guitar versus so many people!
And when you can’t beat them, the solution is to join
them. That’s what we’ve had to do; join them.
I recall that at the concert at
Bienal de Sevilla 2004 you said you felt like a little ant.
Do you still feel like that?
At least I’m in the right frame of
mind to be the little ant. I didn’t use to be. Now
I know it.
What have you learned from this
work?
| |
|
“Good
musicians know how to learn from everybody”
|
I’ve learned a great deal. The union
between a flamenco instrument, the guitar, and a large symphony
orchestra. I’ve learned that there are things which
you have to do quite… clear, without improvisations.
And on top of it, give it soul, all that you can. And make
guitar have a place within that great world.
And do you think the classical
musicians have learned something from you?
I hope so, for the sake of the music. May
they learn from flamenco, from me in this case, but may
they learn. Good musicians know how to learn from everybody.
If we don’t learn, we stay where we are, and that’s
a shame.
Josep Pons, the orchestra’s
conductor, says that “a new page in Spanish music
is starting to be written” on combining classical
music with today’s flamenco this way. Do you also
feel like that?
I’m not a critic of my albums, my
music and my projects. Josep Pons must see it more clearly.
And if he says so, then it’s possible. I hope that
it’s of some use, that it serves as a union of flamenco
and classical, that the orchestra isn’t always accompanying
the melody or the harmony that I do, but rather they make
my music or that of another flamenco… and quite well.
Do you think that flamenco has
a certain complex with regards to classical?
There’s always been like a bit of
musical racism towards flamenco. I think that’s going
to be smoothed over with the new generations, with the thinking
heads and the good musicians there are nowadays. Everything’s
moving forward in this era and you know more things, so
that will end.
Moreover, albums like this demonstrate
that they’re really close worlds…
It was already demonstrated by those great
composers like Falla and Albéniz. And the ideal thing
is for it to go on being like that, since music is universal.
It isn’t that there’s good or bad music. Music
is music; there are seven notes and it’s the same
all over the world. I really like the jazz world and I’m
not a jazz guitarist. I come from Andalusia, I’m a
flamenco guitarist, I’ve played with cantaores and
I like jazz. Why? Because there are really nice standards,
really nice and really interesting scores that can contribute
a lot to modern flamenco guitar.
Precisely, there’s music
in the album’s repertoire by Astor Piazzolla, Michel
Camilo and Erkan Orgur. Why those three pieces?
They’re versions I’ve done
on previous records. When I chose them, it was because I
liked them. And I wanted to see them here played by a big
orchestra.
And what did Michel think of it?
He hasn’t heard it yet, but I hope
he likes it. And if not, then he’ll tell me off and
I’ll do it better on the next one.
How were the flamenco styles chosen,
the ones that were going to be best played or adapted by
the orchestra?
Exactly. They perform the taranta well,
since it’s free music, there isn’t anything
to cling to. That’s why I chose the taranta to start
off the disc, like a bit of rondeña, then it goes
into taranta and my daughter does the taranta by La
Niña de los Peines. It’s arranged by Amargós
and played by the symphony orchestra. Then the soleá
is something rhythmic, but it’s unhurried, understandable,
it goes slowly… and they can express the melodies
that I do.
But the tangos…
The tangos were a challenge… but
they worked in them perfectly.
The record company says that it
has already signed Ángeles Fernández, your
daughter, who does vocals and lyrics here. How would you
present her?
She’s a girl who likes cante and
she wants to make her way and she has to do so well. I’m
her father, but I’m critical with my children, just
like with any flamenco. She has to be an enthusiast and
to like it and to try and do it better and better, which
is what we all try to do.
It’s been a complicated start,
hasn’t it?
Since she has a nice voice and sings in
tune... In order to sing with an orchestra you have to have
somewhat special tuning, as if you were another instrument;
if not, your ear rejects it, even if you don’t know
anything about music. It’s a virtue I’ve found
in her and she’s pleasant to listen to.
Are there other flamenco musicians
in the recording?
Lucky Losada on percussion, who carries
the metronome, and then the clapping. The flamencos here
are flamencos; they didn’t have to adapt to anything.
Of course, the audience here won’t
find that flamenco…
| |
|
“Sonanta
Suite is an album to listen to, you have to adapt your
ear”
|
There are people who are used to that like
more savage edge. Play por bulerías there! What a
phenomenon! You’re a machine! This is something else,
this is an album to listen to, you have to adapt your ear.
And now I’m going to get started with my flamenco
album, once again with my things, with my stuff.
And by the way, have you felt the
need to learn music?
| |
|
“I’d
like for the young kids, without losing flamenco’s
identity, to know music”
|
One always has the need to learn music.
As you go along working with musicians from other genres,
you see that they’re naming the chords by their names
and you always need to. I’d like for the young kids,
without losing flamenco’s identity, to know music.
And if they tell you that the scale is in G minor, then
you know which notes correspond and you play it. Music is
mathematical and it’s really easy: four parts, two
and a half plus one and a half equals four, two plus two…
And thus you seek the score and the scene… if you
know it! If not, then you do it out of habit and by intuition,
but it’s a little harder. And nowadays kids learn
computers, this and that, the same as they know that they
can’t skip from this chord to that one because your
ear has to have a step first and all those little things.
Kids are going to learn that now for sure.
What have you felt here at the
studio when listening to ‘Sonanta suite’?
A little nervous listening to it with people,
seeing what they think of it, what this means to them…
It’s been exciting.
More
information, audio, orders
