El Torta, flamenco cantaor. Interview
“Truth is missing in today’s
flamenco”
Silvia Calado. Madrid, November 2007
Translation: Joseph Kopec
As if he were making his début.
El
Torta returns with that humility. The Jerez-born cantaor
keeps repeating that he has to learn, that he has to “scrutinize
cante”, that he’s just getting started...
even though he’s a veteran. He knows he has a faithful
band of followers on his side who call themselves ‘tortistas’.
And he knows he has personal and artistic qualities which
make him unique, different. That’s how he vindicates
himself on ‘Momentos’, an album recorded with
the warmth of a live performance, a record calling for
that authenticity so often missing from today’s
flamenco cante.
Why do you feel that you’re
starting over?
Well, to be honest, I’ve wasted
a lot of time. I hadn’t recorded for fifteen years,
I was with the greats, then I missed the train and now
I’m starting over. That’s why I’m really
nervous. You feel more afraid each day, or perhaps you
feel more responsibility. That’s where I’m
at right now, but I’m aware of it. And the only
thing I’m going to do is scrutinize cante again,
to try for people to feel it, to get across to them and
make them happy, since that’s my satisfaction. Since
I’ve wasted so much time, I have to make up for
it. And I think it’s possible, that I’ve found
it. As soon as I catch up a little with the work there’s
going to be, I think I’ll be up to it as far as
technique goes.
Do you have to train?
The thing is I didn’t rehearse;
I did it in one go. People take a year, six months, well-accompanied.
But as far as possible, those who follow me like everything
I do and it’s going to be a satisfaction for them.
We’ll see if we can outdo this one we have and make
a better one.
Do you prefer recording live
to the studio?
I like recording live more, but accompanied
with top figures and a good crew, which is what I’ve
had. The thing is that I’ve done it in two or three
recitals. The DVD, however, has technological advances
visually; it has special effects and to me it’s
nice for people to see me different. And the CD sounds
flamenco, but I always have to outdo myself; I’m
never happy. Always for the better, for the better. Like
a bullfighter who always has to do another pass with the
bull; that’s the way I am in flamenco, with a lot
of responsibility and a little bit of fear. I think so,
that everything can be outdone calmly.
Was there a prior selection of
the repertoire or did it arise as you went along?
What came out as I went along, live and
without repetitions. Only a few little things were repeated,
but it was all done in record time. Thank God I had the
cameras, I had the technical equipment, but all in record
time. If I said I didn’t like something and it couldn’t
be repeated either, I had to grin and bear it. At any
rate, I’m mellow because nobody would do it in the
time and way I’ve done it. I’m an unpredictable
person; I don’t rehearse. Now I will have to rehearse
and catch up for the circuit...
El Torta (Photo Daniel Muñoz)
And so as not to drive the guitarist
crazy, don’t you think?
| |
|
| "I
know that those who follow me are going to love
this album, but they should keep an eye out for
the next one, because I think I’ll be able
to outdo it" |
| |
Ha ha ha ha. Yeah, of course.
I’ll be more at ease with my work and more satisfied.
But I don’t think anybody would do it in the time
and way I’ve done it, no matter how professional
they are. You’ve got to have a lot of strength,
a real desire to sing. And they don’t do that; they
have to find themselves, be spoilt... And not me. You
had to do it at three in the afternoon? At three in the
afternoon, then. After eating stew? After eating stew,
then. “Hey, I do this better now”. “But
you can’t”. It had to be that way. I know
that those who follow me like all my stuff. I know they’re
going to love it, but they should keep an eye out for
the next one, because I think I’ll be able to outdo
it.
Is it all accompanied with just
guitar?
There’s a hammer in a martinete
and the bulería about drugs, which is mine, goes
with a drum or box drum, something like that. And I thank
Tomasito
and Tino
di Geraldo who came and did some clapping for me,
because I was there singing all by myself. It’s
not the same as being there, come on, let’s go (and
he cheers and claps his hands). They let me do it
because they allow me a lot of things... because they’ve
listened to me carefully.
There are messages of yours in
the lyrics...
Yeah, the one about drugs is mine, also
‘Solo’ and a small tribute to Luis de la Pica,
which is called ‘Viaje al cielo’. That’s
where they’ve stuck in some special effects on the
DVD.
Why Luis de la Pica?
| |
|
| "They
had to stop Luis de la Pica and not let him in for
him not to shake up the status quo" |
| |
Because he’s a cantaor who’s
very personal, very different, very romantic and very
bohemian. And he reaches us because he’s an artist
of artists. That’s the hardest thing. Because when
you’re an artist, they don’t let you in. If
you’re normal, you can come in. And he was one of
the good ones, one of the geniuses. But they had to stop
him and not let him in for him not to shake up the status
quo, of course. A lot of people want stardom but they
share it out and when someone unique comes along, they
get annoyed. To me, Luis de la Pica was a genius.
Do you feel different, like him?
Yeah, I feel different. I mean, the thing
is we’re not packaged yet. Do you get me? We’re
still really natural, really green. And there are expressions,
feelings, there’s communication and there isn’t
that studio technique which is really cold, but rather
there are graceful things. But as long as there are a
couple of little things which do that to you and stand
your hair up on end... I know there are, because I’ve
listened to the album calmly and I know there’s
good stuff on it. I’m satisfied. With the way I
did it, which is in record time, in two recitals and a
bit more. I’m happy.
It’s a hard way to reach
the audience with what’s out there...
So nice, so well set-up, like that...
Yeah, it’s hard. But when you realize what’s
there, even if it’s just a little bit, you’re
going to say play it again for me. God willing, we’ll
see if we can outdo it. I’m working on it.
El Torta (Photo Daniel
Muñoz) |
|
|
|
Do you think truth is missing
in today’s flamenco?
Truth is missing. Although more modern
or more commercial things are being done, truth is missing
in today’s flamenco. Poetry is beautiful, no matter
what they say. And you can’t let yourself be fooled
by money or anything. I wouldn’t stand it for money.
I’d stand it for two, three days. I live on flamenco
and flamenco is what feeds me. I see the audience is proud.
For me to give them satisfaction feeds me, even if it’s
a minority, even if it’s with less money. What I
do want is to outdo this and give something more important,
recorded better.
What cantaores do you think give
that truth?
There are few. There are a lot of people
who sing well, there are young people who are real enthusiasts,
but nearly all the greats have died. There’s Agujetas,
who’s half crazy. There’s Manuel Moneo, who
sings really well. I like Menese.
There’s Vicente
Soto. But the ones I really, really like are all dead.
But the ones who are there are good artists, and moreover,
professionals to the max.
It gives you satisfaction that
young people keep coming out of Jerez, doesn’t it?
It’s true, in Jerez there are young
people who are delightful; they really are. Young and
singing well. There’s a powerful takeover. They’re
really professional, sometimes more so than someone who’s
been in it for twenty years. They’re enthused, they
sing straight out... they’re going to move ahead
because they deserve it.
And moreover, many are tortistas...
All of them! Ha ha ha ha. I
don’t know any more if it’s because of my
cante, my way, my experience or by ear. I might have very
few qualities, but that handful has something. They might
admire me for that; for my deeds. And it’s true
that I’m an artist of artists. Oh yeah, I have followers.
Check it out; this morning I was interviewed on the radio
and the journalist told me he’s a tortista!
